I think the one thing that really needs to be looked at here, is how broadly have you looked at the CrossFit community Daniel?
My ‘box’ CrossFit Gold Coast trains professional athletes, 55yr old men and 20 yr olds alike. We all do the same thing, as for the athletes, one of the most nameable is Bernard Tomic, a young tennis player from here who although low ranked has qualified for multiple world class events. Crossfit is his personal choice of fitness training.
Crossfit will never provide the complete training for sports, it doesnt claim to. We train functional movements at full range in ways that can enable us to move the most weight possible, the fastest. Studies are currently being run examining the effectiveness of the CrossFit style of training. You ask why none have been published yet? because they take time, as you would know from your college professor friends (not an attack, simply a statement). Crossfit for athletes is simply the fitness component. The skills still come from the sport specific training obviously.
Going back to my initial statement, my trainer was a professional rugby player, as are some of the guys who train with us, others have weightlifting backgrounds but i think people often view crossfit as a bunch of people who view Glassman as God and follow his every word… we dont!
The way in which the Workout Of the Day (WOD)s are programmed by my trainer is done in a way so that we can increase strength, work the core and do a ‘metcon’ workout every day, these follow progressions where they may be short, heavy workouts to build strength or longer, bodyweight excersises for better endurance.
Small classes and constant supervision enables no loss of form, i do agree in some ways things need to change with the “CFHQ” site. This encourages people to perform movements without any coaching and that is very unsafe, but the crossfit affiliates nearly always design their own workouts.
As for the plyometrics issues that were raised by nick above. In box jumps, what exactly is achieved by jumping off? in plyometric movements the work is performed by jumping onto the box, explain to me what is a better option for decending from the box.
Almost done, but for scaling, scaling only ever is done by the person in question when they have limitations, if someone cannot do a movement safely they can decrease weight or if needed they can substitute (should someone be unable to run they can row etc.)
Never in my training at CrossFit have i seen any sign of a person substituting movements or anything that would promt the statement “But no real guidance is given as to how to “scale” a workout. If it is left up to the individual then they might as well come up with their own workout as well.”
Daniel, i am curious to know what your personal advice is to someone who wants to not only be able to lift heavy weight but also run fast and long distances? if CrossFit is NOT an option, what perse is?
All i ask is please dont say isolation excersises and long runs though or my current opinion of your qualifications will die haha 
Box jumps then stepping off? How utterly amateurish, this defeats the whole plyometric action behind the exercise. ]]>
If all that you claim to have accomplished is true - congrats. Sounds like you have quite the pedigree, but your knowledge (or at least application of knowledge) is suspect considering the way our bodies react to explosive movements.
But I’ll be sure to send you an email the next time I’m slinging sand bags to save my home. Thanks for letting me know you won’t quit.
]]>“Even with extended training, no one is able to sustain true explosive power over a long period of time. Olympic lifts such as the Clean and the Snatch are dangerous to the back, knees, and shoulders when performed past the phase of phosphocreatine release.”
This is utter nonsense.
If you lived in a flood plain, would you stop slinging sand bags to save your home because, “sorry, my back, knees and shoulder are past the phase of phospocreatine release”???
If you lived in snow country, would you stop shoveling your driveway after 15 shovel-fulls because “Sorry, Macassistance says I must stop because the body is not able to sustain explosive power”????
If you were loading a truck with supplies such as sacks of grain, would you stop tossing the supplies after the 10th rep? Would you tell the boss man you’re done, you’ve exceeded your limit? When he tells you you’re an out of shape pussy, would you show him your CSCS credential to prove otherwise?
I’ve worked several hard labor jobs that required dynamic lifting for hours on end. The choice was to keep either lifting and get in shape or go home unemployed. You can’t seriously be saying that sustained explosive power is neither trainable and nor useful, can you?
I have the same CSCS credential. I also have a USA Weightlifting coaching credential, a USAW referring credential, and several Crossfit credentials. I’ve trained Olympic weightlifters, Crossfitters, rowers, and even world champion dancers. I’ve won medals in weightlifting, in rowing, and in running. At age 50 I surpassed the Navy Seal entrance swim test by some 30 seconds. I have some idea what I’m talking about. You sir, do not.
]]>I do not think I will ever high rep Olympic lifts again, not until I am strong in them. I think its a skill and not a high intense movement. I see the flaws in trainers who are inexperienced training people who are bio-mechanically unsound from being unfit, sitting for long periods and being inflexible then throwing them into high rep workouts without a build up. My martial arts students take things to failure and failure in my eyes is the moment that good form degenerates. I dont see the point of doing reps after that time.
I know a lot of boxes are changing how they do things. With linear strength progressions and practicing skills and making a more logical program that takes into account a persons need to progress. Some are even switching off the timer and allowing people to slow down and concentrate on keeping their form strict.
I think there just needs to be a better certification process perhaps that really goes into teaching people HOW to program, what the movements do and the science behind the training. There needs to be more education. Because, frankly, people give PT’s shit for their minimal training.
]]>I watched a recent CF race video with room full of people racing deadlifts! This is exactly what Rippetoe instructs NOT to do yet they quote/reference him often. Starting Strength argues that open chain exercise will lose form after ~5 reps reguardless of what the lifter thinks they have done. And one bad deadlift can stop your life as you know it.
]]>Having said that, until starting school I worked at hard physical labor, ive pumped septic tanks, warehouse work, concrete and construction, farm work. It makes the body strong, stronger than most. As a septic cleaner you end up digging 3ft holes all day lifting heavy concrete covers or manhole covers, dragging heavy 6inch house hundreds of feet and lifting liftng liftng. 6inch hose gets really heavy when filled with wwaste. Concrete work, warehouse…its all the same constant repetitios lifting over and over and over. Funny thing about this is, as long as you lift correctly few ever get hurt from this. IF lifting is done correctly. I remember one job in particular where we dug a 6ft deep trench 12 feet long and 4 feet wide, by hand, lifting out buckets of dirt 100-200pound rocks from the botton and this went on for a few days, 8-10 hours a day. And we lived thru it and we wee not hurt.
So then as i look at crossfit training and am considering how to get back into an exercise routine Ive had some thoughts about this. While on the surface it would appear that 30 reps of a clean and jerk with heavy weight may seem injourous, that may not be nesecarily true. I would be if your body was not accustomed to such things. I am certainly not going to do that now, as I stit on my butt in school and behind the counter at the bookstore, yet where I doing warehouse work or concrete again i wouldnt think twice about it, and in fact we would do these sort of things for fun on the job, who was the strongets, who could caryy the most rock the fastes, how far can you throw those boulder out of the whole… but we where accustmed to that sort of thing. Now my body is still strong, but im getting flabby muscle strength endurance, cardio endurance is terrible so i am certainly not going to do high rep heavy deadlifts. im going to do whats right for me. I think this is something that is at times lost in crossfit as i understand it so far. Is a high rep heavy lift exercise bad, not by itself, no neither is random exercise thrown together over a week. Its what laborers do consistently every day. But…they are accustomed to it. And this is the key. the injuries that do occur in laboring jobs, occur afte layoffs, as a newbie is starting a job for the first time, as a boss decides he is going to “work with the guys today” thats when the injuries occur. The old timers, they guys who do this everyday…some of the strongest healthiest people you’ll meet. they practise crossfit 5-6days a week 8-12 hours a day, only they call it work. ]]>
Opinions?
As a footnote, I dropped by my friend’s CrossFit location a few months ago (briefly, to drop off some work-related stuff) and owner/trainer was late opening up because, according to one of patrons waiting out front, “she got caught up at the chiropractor’s” - and I thought to myself HA, you were right about this stuff being terrible for joints. For all we know, there may be a whole subset of people (CF population) in for a hell of a lot of arthritic problems in the near future…
]]>Crossfit is better than nothing - but that is not much of an achievement.
Crossfit is not worse than people crippling themselves in normal gyms - that’s not much of an achievement either.
Crossfit uses olympic and power lifts which are new to some people and fun. But olympic and power lifting were always there and Crossfit didn’t invent either. Look at the videos of the recent Crossfit Games and see how poorly those competitors perform snatches and presses. What’s the point???
Crossfit planning seems completely random. If it so good, when will we see a sport won by someone who trains completely in Crossfit? Answer: never. ]]>
In that time I’ve lost 14 lbs, toned up considerably and my knee has stopped hurting. I train at a Crossfit ‘box’ so my experience might not be reflective of someone trying to do this stuff on their own.
I think it would be difficult to learn to Clean and Jerk from the internet and I can see a potential for injury in anyone trying to do so.
I think some of your criticisms might be valid but these debates remind me of stuff from the martial arts community on who has the best punching technique or whatever. You can pick holes in absolutely anything if you try. The question is ‘does it work?’ and ‘does it suit you?’
Personally I find the intensity of the workouts much preferable to a conventional gym slog and I enjoy the relatively cheap personal training and social aspect of Crossfit. You talk to people at these classes, which I never did in 20 years of the gym.
This group mentality encourages me to stick with the programme.
Yes, there may be some questions over high rep Olympic lifting but I’m not aware of anyone at my Crossfit gym having suffered injuries. The reverse is true. Many people have found chronic problems getting better.
There’s also a lot of low rep Olympic lifting, which I’ve found very interesting and beneficial. You just won’t get taught that at an average gym.
That said, people will get injured doing Crossfit, as they get injured doing anything.
But how many people cripple themselves in normal gyms? At least Crossfit - if you attend a Crossfit gym - is intensively instructed. Go into LA Fitness, look around at people doing their flyes and curls and wince.
So Crossfit is at least an improvement on the standard model of chain gym - one induction lesson and off you go.
I agree there is pseudo science involved in Crossfit, though that doesn’t mean it has nothing of value to say. And the rest of the fitness industry is hardly a bulls$$t free zone. At least Crossfit is open to questioning its techniques. It is not a fixed system but a work in progress.
It’s also, and this is the key thing, a lot of fun. By changing the workouts all the time it keeps you mentally engaged.
It might not be the best all-round fitness programme I’ve done. I would say that was Judo. It is,however, a very good fitness programme and miles better than anything we have on offer in the UK at the moment. ]]>